From childcare to elder care: Supporting employees through every caregiving stage.

Merrell Botello: Hi, everyone! Good morning, good afternoon. We're gonna get started in just a minute.

Hi, Angela, good morning. If you want, just, you know, put into the chat where you're… where you're calling from, city and state, because this is a… national live webinar. We'd love to see where you're coming from. Yeah, I myself, I'm in Los Angeles, California.

Madhvi, where are you… where are you at today?

Madhavi Vemireddy: I'm in the Bay Area, in California.

Merrell Botello: Good, good.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Looks like we have a lot of Californians on the call so far.

Merrell Botello: Yeah, it's a lot of familiar names, too. Hi, everyone. All right. We could go ahead and get started. This is going to be a very meaningful conversation, so thank you for being here.

But just wanted to set the tone here. We know every day, employees juggle more than deadlines. You know, you're also taking care of kids, perhaps parents, loved ones, even pets. And for most, work and home flow together, so that's just the real life.

And here's the key, while empathy may be the heart of why so many of us choose HR as a profession, this conversation is just as much about strategy, so we're excited for this. And just to put on a personal note, you know, caregiving does touch all of us, whether it's Something your employees bring to you, or something you've experienced yourself. So that's why today we created this space for the conversation, which is, from childcare to elder care, supporting employees through every caregiving stage.

And on today's agenda, you can see this roadmap here. And give me just a second, I want to make sure I'm seeing the screen here. So, you can see the roadmap for our session. I won't read every point, but the big picture goes like this. So, we're going to ground ourselves in what caregiving looks like today. We're going to get real about the gaps that we're seeing, and then focus on how HR, can take practical steps to support employees at every stage. And at the end, hopefully, we'll get some activity in the chat box where you could ask your questions throughout the presentation, and at the end, we will talk through those questions and perhaps maybe even experiences.

And a housekeeping reminder here, we're gonna for sure share the slides and the recording in the next 24 hours, so let's go ahead and kick it off.

So, brief introductions here on the call today. Myself, hi everyone, Mero Botello, partner here at Nava Benefits, and my approach is pretty simple. If it matters to you, it matters to me. I've spent nearly two decades in this work, starting my career in HR, and that background really taught me to always put myself in other people's shoes, and it's why empathy guides how I approach employee benefits. And also, let's know, every company culture is unique, and that's why I believe caregiving isn't just talk for the break room, water cooler talk, or, you know, virtual talk. It belongs in the boardroom when you're making benefit decisions.

And so with that, it's my pleasure to introduce a true game changer in this space, Dr. Madhavi Vemaretti, CEO of Cleo. Madhavi, hello, hello!

Madhavi Vemireddy: Hello, thank you, Merrill, for having me. It's a pleasure to be here to talk about caregiving. For me, it's not just my professional journey, it is very much my personal journey. I'll start with my personal background. I'm a mom of two boys, 14 and 10. I've been an active caregiver for my eldest son since he was born. He had, Born with a rare congenital heart anomaly, needed open-heart surgery at 9 months, we… which fixed the heart issue, which we were so thankful for. And then, as he was catching up, he started walking at age 2, But at age 5, was diagnosed as being on the autism spectrum. So today at 14, minimally speaking, still have significant motor delays, and I'm still actively caregiving for him, and… My husband and I are both physicians, and… this is a struggle. This is a challenge, that even though we understand the clinical aspects of his care, there's still so much we don't know, and we, you know, have over the years piecemealed together this plan.

And we essentially said, if we're struggling. how are other folks doing this? And, and so that is… really what led us to start a company, that was focused on supporting family caregivers, whether you're taking care of an adult loved one or you're taking care of a child with special healthcare needs. I came to Cleo 3 years ago. My background is in population health. I'm a physician by training. Really built programs that were aimed at Patients, individuals with chronic health conditions. but saw a significant gap with respect to caregivers. I said, no one's engaging the caregiver, no one is supporting the caregiver, and they're the largest providers of care in this country, when you think about unpaid caregivers. And so Cleo and the company I co-founded with my, with my husband, Care Tribe, came together 3 years ago, because Cleo started in pregnancy and parenting, and through the acquisition of the company, I started… expanded into adult care. So now Cleo's supporting families Across all life stages, and so really excited to share more about… about the support we provide.

Merrell Botello: Advi, thank you for sharing. That really puts it in perspective. As far as, you know, the need to talk about it, and… With that, like, I do want to bring in Nava a little bit. We're the host of today's webinar, and who we are is that we think of ourselves as that modern benefits brokerage. And Madhavi, what you shared is, like, truly, you know, why I'm in the business as well, because we're standing, side-by-side with HR teams, just trying to help manage costs. navigate the complexities, and then just keep the employee experience at the center. And what makes this different in our space is how we use our technology. You might have seen it online, but we have NAVA HQ, and it's a way that we could use it for advocacy as well for employees and for HR teams.

Where wellness, which is what our topic is today, it's not just an afterthought, it's actually built in. And I'll be honest, this renewal season feels a lot heavier than most. I'm hearing from so many HR leaders, we're facing rising costs and very difficult conversations, so just want to take a moment to say thank you. I'm grateful for all of you that are here today, just taking the time to focus on wellness.

Because we're in the thick of renewal season, and ultimately, it's all connected. So, again, thank you for being here. From Nava and myself. Yeah, let's go dive into more of Cleo. I'm so interested to see.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yeah, so, for those of you who don't, or are not familiar with Cleo, haven't heard of Cleo, essentially we are a global family care platform. We support families across all stages of life, from pregnancy through parenting, toddlers to teens, adult care, elder care.

And we do this by taking a population health approach. So what do I mean by that? Essentially, it's… we know that caregivers could be at different stages of their caregiving journey. They could be at different levels of burnout. So… It's really important… For us to use analytics to identify.

Is this a caregiver that is at… already at a high risk of burnout, or are they… are they on the path to burnout, so that we can apply the right set of interventions to mitigate that risk? We have a team of experts that, have expertise across these different life stages, so… Midwives, doulas, lactation experts, to sleep coaches, parent educators, neurodivergence experts, dementia providers, master-level social workers.

Because we see families across So many different care journeys, and so it's really important for us to make sure that every family is matched with a human expert that has expertise in the life stage that they're in, or in the, you know, the care of the loved ones that, you know, they're responsible for. And… We're, you know, focusing on the needs of the… of the caregiver, as well as those that, you know, their caregiver is taking care of, their children, their parents. their partner or spouse. And we also have our digital platform. So, where we're, curating the right level of education and resources that is very specific to the care journey that you might be in. So really bringing The coaching aspects of it, as well as the care navigation. Let us help you source childcare. Let us help you source elder care resources, like, you know, assisted living, or finding an in-home care provider. Really trying to take things off of the caregiver's plate. Ease their caregiving burden, right, decrease their risk of burnout, mental health strain, and keep them in the workforce, and, you know, be able to, be productive, because they're not constantly juggling, all things related to caregiving. And I think, you know, one of the things that, we… and I'm sure many, many of you have heard about is this… our caregiving crisis, right? We… we're in a place right now where we've got our aging demographics, you know, expected over the next 5 years that 20% of our population in the U.S. is going to be 65 plus.

We also have, on the other side of it, you know, childcare shortages. And so when you think about the sandwich generation, who are taking care of children, taking care of parents. Most of this is falling to folks in their 40s and 50s, over, like, 50% of those And those age bands are part of the sandwich generation. And we know that majority of the caregivers are women. Women and people of color. Right, they're really shouldering the majority of that responsibility. For myself, I sort of refer to it as the panini generation versus the sandwich, because it really feels like you're getting squeezed on all sides. And, you know, I see the biggest challenge is that because of the stigma related to caregiving, people are not comfortable talking about it. Right? They're worried that their manager is going to think that you know, they've got too much going on. They might be distracted, right? They've gotta, you know, leave early from work, or take time off to, you know, take care of some of their caregiving responsibilities. And so how does it show up? It shows up as a leave of absence, right? Because Caregivers, they power through as long as they can, and then they hit that stage of burnout, and then they're like, okay, something's gotta give.

And that means, you know, I've gotta, you know, focus on family, and so either I have to cut back my hours, or I'm gonna take a leave of absence. Or it's showing up as impact to productivity, but then that's the hidden cost that businesses don't see. Right? Until it's, too late.

Merrell Botello: I'd love to double-click on the businesses. So… when on your website, there's definitely big names like Red Bull, Equinox, they're very good stewards of this caregiving benefit. And then for me, on social media, I see companies like Etsy, Chiovanna.

Really leading that family healthcare. So those are huge companies, so maybe the folks that are on this call might be a small business, middle market, maybe 100, 500 employees. the stories may change sometimes, and when you hear the same struggles I do, especially with wellness, it's a priority, and maybe they have an EAP on their platform, but it often falls short. So, that's why when I'm doing the consulting on these wellness benefits, I'm not shy about bringing up solutions, especially with Cleo. Even for the smaller companies, because that's where, often, the impact is felt the most. So, maybe some feedback on, you know, different sized companies, what you're seeing, in, in that space?

Madhavi Vemireddy: Well, I mean, the reality is, Merritt, like, caregiving's universal, right? It doesn't matter what size company you work at, right? These are real-life struggles, and to your point, when you are a smaller company, you really feel it when an employee goes out and leave, right? And there's real costs Related to that, because now you've got to bring in a contractor, or, you know, you… or you've got to, you know, adjust what deliverables you can actually execute on while this individual is out on leave. And so those costs, you know, typically add up. I saw, you know, analysis that was done, like, for, you know, an employee with an average salary of $80,000. if they take a 12-week leave of absence, if you add up all the costs related to that, it's about $24,000, that you're paying for, for that employee to take a leave. And so now.

If you have 10%, 15% of your employee base that is on a leave at any point in time, that quickly adds up, right? And so… and we do believe, like, some of the leaves can be prevented, because you are preventing burnout from happening in the first place. Obviously, some leaves are… you can't prevent, but then I think there, the focus is more on, like, how do you support that employee while they're on leave, so we can get them back to work.

So, you know, all in all, there… we do have a number of customers that are in the… that 500 and below range, and I think it's… There's still, significant value that we can provide, because to your point earlier, Meryl, we feel that caregiving's at the root cause of the mental health strain, right? At the root cause of why individuals are not able to focus on their own self-care, and these are connected to already the benefits you have in place. Right? Like an EAP, like a well-being. So it really helps drive up that utilization of not only a solution like Cleo, but the solutions you have, across your benefit ecosystem.

Merrell Botello: Yeah, very, very good. Well, the next few minutes, we're gonna show you how we could bridge those gaps and build benefits that's gonna meet your employees where they're at. So let's go with some more stats, which I absolutely love.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yes, so these are industry stats. One is just how, you know, we talk about how universal caregiving is, right? Harvard Business Research Team, they did analysis and found that 73% of employees have some caregiving responsibility. Now, they look at it more broadly, so whether, you know, you're going through a pregnancy journey, having a child, you know, parenting, or taking care of an adult loved one, right? You are essentially in that 73%. So, you know, that's… pretty much your entire workforce. And then, because… you're constantly juggling, like, you know, I don't like the… I don't like the term work-life balance. There is no balance, right? It's a work-life juggle. And many times, we've got so many balls in the air that we're juggling, it's like, you know, how do we, keep it going? But it's the reason… because of that, there's significant Burnout risk that we are seeing in caregivers, and especially when you're talking about caregivers that are taking care of a loved one with a complex health need.

Or you're talking about adult care or sandwich generation. So 60%, right, are, are at risk for burnout, or suffer from burnout. And then, CDC did an analysis looking at those in the sandwich generation and found that 70% are experiencing depression and anxiety compared to non-caregivers. So we know that caregiving is really at the root cause of, you know, these issues and these conditions.

Merrell Botello: Yeah, we're seeing it definitely on Clayton's side, the mental health has been picking up and getting in that root cause. Like, we do need information, we need data, but also these kind of resources to tackle it, so it's not as ongoing.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Correct, exactly. Because, you know, just addressing the therapy aspect of, let's say, depression. Obviously that's a really critical aspect of the care that that individual needs, but then, you know, you're not getting at the root cause of what is causing that mental health strain. And how do we help, alleviate some of that caregiving burden or strain so that, in conjunction with therapy, we can drive, greater improvements in that individual's well-being?

Merrell Botello: Yeah, thank you. Let's talk about the next hidden costs of, the caregiving… caregiver neglect.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yeah, so what we're seeing with our data is that if you are at high risk of burnout, right, and here's the challenge, I think benefit leaders have, and, you know, the C-suite has in general, is that You know, the focus is so much on your healthcare costs, right? You know, driving up your premiums. You don't see caregiving on a claim line. Right? And that's the biggest challenge that we hear from benefit leaders, because now you have to build the business case behind why do we need a caregiving solution in place. And, you know, what we've been educating benefit leaders around is we need to start looking at a caregiving solution as a health benefit.

Not as a perk, or a talent. you know, retention or attraction benefit. Yes, it has that aspect to it, but primarily, we have to see it as a health benefit, because from our data, if you are at high risk for burnout, we see significant impact to self-care. Right? These individuals, they're now putting themselves last. on their to-do list, right? They've got their work deliverables, they have things they have to do for their family to take care of them, so they're not sleeping well, they're not eating well, they're not exercising, they're not seeing their PCP, so they're missing their important preventive health you know, screening, and so, actually CDC did an analysis and found, looking at 16 health conditions, that caregivers have higher prevalence of 13 out of 16 conditions compared to non-caregivers. And this is obesity. Hypertension, depression. arthritis, you know, pulmonary conditions like asthma. So it's really, when you look at that data, you say, wow.

Some of the patients that were in our care delivery system, right, that we're focused on with our diabetes solution or our musculoskeletal solution, they're caregivers. And caregiving really could be that barrier. To them focusing on their own health. Right? And so, you know, that's, you know, I think an important component of us understanding what is the impact of caregiving on, you know, on health, especially related to delayed preventive care, and higher incidence of chronic health conditions. We also know that From the data that we're collecting, that if you are at high risk for burnout, you're also, seeing a significant impact to productivity, whether that is absenteeism or presenteeism. And so, you know, we see that high correlation, so about On an annual basis, those individuals that are at high risk for burnout are losing almost 11 weeks of total, of lost productivity time.

And so that's huge, right? That's almost 3 months of the year that you just… you're not able to, work because of your caregiving responsibilities. And then finally, it's the correlation with mental health that we talked about earlier. You know, one of the biggest areas of referrals that we make is into an EAP solution, or into a wellness solution, because we find that, especially those that are at high risk of burnout, almost three-quarters of them Have early signs and symptoms of depression and anxiety.

Merrell Botello: No. Thank you for that. On to the right of this slide, I just want to remind you, you're going to get something in your inbox tomorrow, but with this.

Madhvi, I have a question. So, when HR is looking at adding, any benefits, especially this new family caregiving benefit, what's the best way to bring the CFO into the conversation? I know it should be early, so you're not only talking about strategy, but also lining up on that… the financial goals. So, what have you seen on that end to help HR Bring this into the.

Madhavi Vemireddy: I mean, I think what's key and what our benefit guide, goes through is help in building that business case, right? Really identifying the connection points between caregiving and healthcare, mental health, right? Productivity, leaves of absence, and really helping the benefit leader frame it up. with, you know, the stats, the, you know, what is essentially the return on investment, right? The value on investment. And so, you know, part of the work we do is to estimate Based on the size of the, employer, right, their demographics. what's the impact, what's the hidden cost related to caregiving, and what do we expect the cost savings to look like with a solution like Cleo in place?

Merrell Botello: Yeah, thank you. That's one of our tasks, too, on the broker side, is to help out with that.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yes, yeah, so very important. And, you know, part of, the analytics that we talked about, earlier is really around how do we measure the health and well-being of caregivers. Because it's not showing up on a claim line, because it's not data that, employers readily have access to, unless they're asking it, you know, about caregiving in their, like, annual, you know, employee survey, you really don't know. Right? And so, for us, it was really important to not just identify, like, who's caregiving or not, but also to understand how it is impacting their own health and well-being. So we created a tool called the Family Health Index.

It's looking at these seven dimensions that you see here. It's… Two, three questions for each one of these dimensions, so really, under 10 minutes, you can finish that assessment, and the member will get a real-time report, where they can see, clearly, red, yellow, green for each one of these areas to say, where are they doing well, where do they need to keep an eye out? And monitor how they're progressing, and where do they need help now?

And this is information that then helps, you know, identify and curate the right resources for them within our digital platform, but also where our coaches get the same information so they can be more proactive and delivering the right set of interventions. And so this is really important because now we're going to start arming benefit leaders with data, at least at an aggregate level, so they can see how their employees are doing, especially across different life stages.

And this is one of the reports that they would typically see, but this just highlights, like, across our book of business, what is the… what is the risk of caregiving burnout? Blended, you know, across our book of business, we see about 33% that are at high risk of burnout.

So, about a third of our population. But you can look at it by life stage, and we also look at this by care journeys, but, like, if you look at it by life stage, you can see that as you… as your kids start getting older. Right? And, or if you are taking care of an adult loved one, or if you're in that sandwich generation. Right? That's where you're close to, you know, 50% or more than 50% of our members in those life stages, are at high risk of burnout.

And then we also look at it by, what care journey they're in, right? Because we see about a third of our families are in a complex care journey, so essentially meaning they're taking care of a child with neurodivergence, or a learning disability, or a child mental health. They're taking care of a parent with falls, dementia, Parkinson's disease, and… or they're going through a high-risk pregnancy, or have a child in the NICU, right? So these are these complex care journeys. And what we find is, you know, if you are in a complex care journey, your burnout risk is significantly more than the 50%. So neurodivergence is actually one of our, high, you know, highest risk, care journeys that we have. And, you know, and… given that this is my personal journey, like, I believe, like, I can see how easy it is for, you know, parents and neurodivergent children To be at burnout.

Right? Because the needs are constant, and you're really trying to pull together a number of therapies, you know, to support your child. And that financial strain as well is pretty significant. And so this is really important for us, because now we're going to use this… the Family Health Index data, not only to set the baseline. at an individual level, at a population level, but also then to track over time what impact we are having, right? And being able to demonstrate back that impact. To benefit leaders.

Merrell Botello: Thank you. On the next slide, let's… let's talk more about this, because with these stats in front of us, I'm always thinking about the benefits. Like, okay, if there's burnout, let's take some time off. But when people do take time off, whether it's a leave or their own PTO, that employee still needs help, right? You just don't leave… leave them hanging while they get PTO, so let's… let's talk about that more, too.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yeah, I… you know, I've heard from benefit leaders where, you know, where employees come to them and they say, you know, my mom just, you know, has chronic health issues, there's a lot going on that I need to take care of, and the solution is to take a leave. And that is definitely what may be needed, especially when you're dealing with an acute situation. But then there's so much to coordinate, right? So now that employee is on their own. Trying to, you know, figure out what the plan is, what, you know, what the support plan needs to be for their loved one.

How are they going to find the right resources? Maybe they need meal delivery or transportation, or maybe they need to know what questions to ask their physician so they can be more proactive versus reactive. How do you prevent a fall in the home? Maybe you need to get a home safety assessment done. Right? Or maybe you need to, if you're navigating a cancer diagnosis for your partner while they're going through chemotherapy, maybe you need to now come up with childcare, support during that, or tutoring support while you're going through this journey. And so, it's… That is… is a… when someone's on leave, that is a very critical period of time where that employee needs significant support, to manage that emotional strain that they're going through, right, to make sure that they're not at high risk of burnout. What we see, you know, with some of our employers where we are Pulling in their leave files, and we are, engaging members when they're on leave. One is we see, high degree of engagement. So, like, over 65%, are actively engaging with our coaches while they're on leave.

But we are also seeing, you know, high return to work rates, like 85% return-to-work rates, right? Because It's faster to get them the support they need, so they're not out there trying to figure it out, and then that, you know, they have more confidence, right, on their ability to come back to work, because now they've got the right plan in place.

You know, the data here, Merrill, is just highlighting the significant mental health strain that we're seeing, in this population, right? And… and I think, you know, the… Obviously, you can see it's, you know, 60% across the book, but then when you look at certain care journeys, like if you're in end-of-life care, or you're taking care of a parent with cancer, right, now you're, you know, high 60s.

It's really important to, understand that most of these individuals don't perceive that they have a mental health need. they feel like, I'm going through a really stressful time. I just have to power through it. Right? My family's depending on me. And it's not until we present data back to them and say, wow, you know, it really looks like you're going to need some additional help here to support your emotional well-being. Maybe it's therapy, right? Maybe it's counseling, while you're going through this difficult journey, so that you can show up As your best self to take care of your… children, or take care of your, adult loved ones. And that… creates that intrinsic motivation, or like, oh, yeah, okay, that makes sense. And so that's the reason why we end up driving, up to 4 times higher utilization of an EAP for those that are participating in Cleo versus not, because we're doing that proactive screening, and that coaching. To really help them recognize that there is a need.

Merrell Botello: No. And wanted to call out, we're talking about EAP and LEAVs. Just wanted to call out here, those programs, which we manage, we help manage, are often reactive. So, supporting people once they're already in a crisis.

One thing where I found is a big difference here with Cleo is that you all step in earlier, which is very, very important. And another piece, because, you know, I have called it a Cleo guide, and I've seen reviews that members call it, like, a lifesaver, just someone a text away with tailored advice.

So, for me, when I call a 1-800 number, there's an intake form, and there's all that. It kind of loses the whole, like, hey, I need help right now. So, what Cleo does is at least, you know, get the employees engaged. And then they could have someone to talk to, like, year-round, not just at time of crisis. So I find that super helpful.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yes, definitely. And when you have that trusted relationship, even if you're not at a time of crisis. Right? Then, to your point, when that crisis does occur, you know who to go out to, right? To be like, oh, this is who I… I need to reach out to this… to my guide, because I have that relationship, and I know, you know, he or she is going to help me through this.

Merrell Botello: And that's… that's obviously important, because you don't want them going through this journey by themselves.

Yeah, and a call here, too, is Cleo is essentially not replacing the benefits of EAP or mental health, it's working side by side, so the benefits that you do have in place, employees would have easier access and know where to go, and to me, it feels more impactful when someone's guiding you.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yes, absolutely.

Merrell Botello: All right, you know, I love the information that you're providing, and for us, on the benefits consulting side, we do see gaps, and, you know, not every employer has the budget or the stats that you just presented. So I want to go over, some common gaps. A lot of it we already talked about, but… From the broker side, it's our job here to just help HR leaders spot these issues early, and then shape the strategy so we could move the needle. So the first one, if we could play around with this, is that limited visibility. We called it out. Most HR teams don't realize who's caregiving until it shows up, maybe in burnout or crisis.

So, helping employees get ahead with that data, perhaps running those surveys, and of course, we have benchmarking, but we need to do it early. So, we specifically tap into the advocacy platform within Novice HQ to help with that. What do you see on your side? Like, how would you help with the visibility?

Madhavi Vemireddy: So definitely with, through, like, the Family Health Index report, where we are, assessing you know, who they're caregiving for, what caregiving situation they're in, what that impact is to their overall health and well-being. And then, you know, we also have, like, surveys, questions that we, you know, benefit leaders can use to incorporate as part of their overall employee survey to send out.

So that allows, you know, us to, again. Highlight where the needs are, you know, what, you know, where there is value in terms of… Drawing greater connection points between you know, different benefit offerings. So, for example, we typically will do… we may do a, like. co-webinar presentation, or maybe it's a communication that we put together, highlighting Cleo, highlighting the EAP, and almost saying, like, when do you… when do you come to Cleo? When do you come to EAP, how we work better together? Sometimes that also helps, employees understand how these two different resources are working together, and that they're complementary.

And so, I think the data that… some of the data I showed earlier is exactly the data that we would be showing at a population level.

Merrell Botello: Okay, good. We don't have to reinvent the wheel.

Madhavi Vemireddy: No.

Merrell Botello: The second one is leave. We've mentioned it quite a bit, and with leave, on my side of the business, I usually see it in two extremes. So, HR teams are… typically, like, super engaged, and then there's the others that don't have that bandwidth to go beyond just the policy, and often I see it just as a paperwork and compliance checklist.

But the employees need support before they go out, while they're out, and when they return. So. that's… that's really important. So, the folks that are in HR that are on this call, like, what are you doing now when employees are on leave? It's… it's important to gauge that. And do you have help?

Trying to keep track of that. Madhvi, what do you think?

Madhavi Vemireddy: I think… I agree that we… especially with the rising number of leaves that a lot of employers are seeing, I think the… to your point earlier, Merrill, there is a significant administrative burden, right, on benefit leaders to manage that.

I also, you know, I think this is a great… example of where, you know, a service like Cleo can come in to do an integration with your Lee files, or, like, or, get a trigger so that we know when someone has taken a leave, so that we can proactively reach out if they're not already engaged with Cleo, to know that they have this service, the support, while they're on leave, and with the focus of, like, how can we get them back to work? So… You know, this is definitely a time of need, and this is, you know, where, services that we provide are… Are most relevant.

Merrell Botello: Yeah, I agree. And the third is over-indexed solutions. So, to me, right now, there's especially a lot of focus on fertility and pregnancy, and as a quick reminder, California's new mandate, SB729, that's going to go into effect January 1st, 2026, so we're talking about that a lot.

But it's important to know that, you know, if there's a shift, we want to make a difference for families. So it reminds me that elder care and self-care, it often doesn't get nearly enough attention in these conversations. So that's also one of the gaps where we need to address the multi-dimensional employees that we have today.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yeah, and we typically hear this a lot, especially with employers that have a multi-generational workforce.

Where they are hearing feedback from, you know, those in their 40s and 50s, what about us? What about, you know, the needs that we're experiencing? And so… and I… and I also think it's important to recognize that Right now, about a quarter of millennials are in the sandwich generation. So it's not just those in their 40s and 50s, so… so even if you've got solutions in place that are supporting the fertility journey or the pregnancy journey,

Right, it's not gonna incorporate other care journeys that those individuals are going through that also may be contributing to their burnout risk.

Merrell Botello: Just a few more here to wrap up the gaps. The point solution fatigue, what that means is too many vendors, so little time. So we're managing a lot of those, file feeds and implementations. So, that could be a gap here, but part of the role is to really streamline, and it sounds like, you know, you and your team will do a lot of the heavy lifting when it comes to the implementation. An advertisement of this new, new service, is that right?

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yeah, absolutely. Implementation can happen within 30 days. You know, if we have an eligibility file, we can be communicating, to, employees around their specific… based on their demographics. specific life stage, you know, support that we provide. And so, definitely can make it a very easy, solution to implement.

Merrell Botello: Music. And last but not least, the lack of parity, which, actually, we have a slide coming up on this one. We're gonna bring this up. And what lack of parity means in caregiving is the responsibilities are not shared equally. And, as you mentioned, women and people of diverse groups often carry much of the heavier load, so we'll talk about that more.

And how we could help. And… Let's, let's get onto the topic and dive in a little bit more. I'm going to share a little… a personal story here. I am proudly a mother of a blended family. We have kids from age 4 to 25, now even a grandchild. My mom recently moved in with us, and also, in the middle of that, had a cancer scare, so you could imagine you know, that's quite a bit for my family this year. And then to top it… to top that all off, my husband's a firefighter, so I don't know when I actually see him. So between childcare, elder care, and everything in between, I'm truly living this.

And I know I'm not alone. So, the reality is, this is happening to employees, and I don't think you called out the stats, but the fact that caregiving mostly falls on women, it's 60-70% of caregivers are women. Is that… is that about right? Yeah. And to me, that means, you know, reducing hours and, you know, taking more time off. possibly turning down promotions, or even, you know, in my set of girlfriends, some of them just stepping out of the workforce altogether. So, you know, thank you for bringing it up. This is not just a benefits conversation, it's a human's… centric conversation, more about, like, making benefits more equal, making people feel belonged, and, like, support people. So I'm all here for that conversation.

I would love, Madhavi to wrap us up and give us some, maybe, some top takeaways, so we could bring this back to, to your teams.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yes, absolutely. And to your point, you know, Merrill, I think… The biggest challenge is because, caregiving is falling so much on women's shoulders, right? And if they're now part of the sandwich generation. And they're getting to the point of burnout, where they can no longer juggle, you know, working and caregiving full-time. They're dropping out. And we saw that with some of the numbers this year, where, you know, over 200,000 women left the workforce because of childcare. And, the challenge there is they're losing I think one analysis found it was, like, over $350,000 of retirement life savings from leaving the workforce. So then that's setting up this vicious cycle, because now when it's time for when they need care for themselves. they're not going to have the financial resources, or they're going to have limited financial resources to support that care for themselves. And so that's why it's so important, to your point, of having… talking about caregiving, so we're… because it is so universal, so we don't have that stigma related to caregiving, but also, how do we keep caregivers in the workforce, right? And get them the support they need so they don't feel You know, that they have to make this difficult choice.

Merrell Botello: Yeah, and I love my job, so I'd like to go to work, like… Nicole, help me out. Let's talk about next steps.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yes.

Merrell Botello: maybe how… It worked with Cleo.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yes, I mean, I… from my perspective, you have one family, you should have one solution, right? It doesn't make sense from a family perspective to say, well, I have to go over here if I'm taking care of my parents, and I have to go over here if I'm going through pregnancy or somewhere else for my childcare.

That's just too complex to navigate, and caregivers don't have time, right? And they're completely overwhelmed, so, you know, that's why… you know, a solution like Cleo that is supporting families across all life stages makes sense. It's easier, it's one family front door for your employees. And I think it's also important to position caregiving as a health benefit. We know that this is a cohort with significant health risks.

So when you're evaluating a caregiving solution, you have to also make sure that you will be finding these individuals at high risk for mental health strain, high risk of burnout, so you can mitigate that risk, right? And then that will help drive You know, You know, avoiding preventable leaves that will help drive improving productivity, and that just builds up a much stronger business case for having a solution that can, impact your mental health. you know, claims costs. And from an implementation standpoint, it's easy, especially with our partnership with NAVA. Cleo can be implemented anytime. It's usually 30 days, 60 days, you know, really for more complex Sort of, you know, implementation needs, but… you know, I think it's important also to remember that, you know, caregiving is 24-7, right? So it's not just during open enrollment, and so how do we support families throughout the year, I would say even if, you know, we can't… you're not in a position to put in a solution like Cleo, then, you know, look at how do we drive more awareness, right, around talking about caregiving, talking about, you know. the resources that are available. Maybe it's a paid leave, maybe it is… highlighting some of the EAP benefits, like, you know, or highlighting other community resources that might be available to support. you know, your employees, but I think the more we talk about it, the more… the more we decrease that stigma, that, you know, many caregivers face, right? Because only half of them are telling their managers about their caregiving responsibilities.

Merrell Botello: Right. Alright. Avi, thank you. And as far as the top takeaways, I know we went over, you know, quite a few stats and follow-ups. But, let's… let's wrap it up here and start, you know, putting in your questions in the chat so we could be ready to answer some. But do you want to close this out?

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yes, I think we, you know, basically, I would say our top takeaways is really focus on a comprehensive caregiving solution, go beyond childcare, or go beyond just elder care, really focus on the full spectrum of caregiving.

I think it's really important for benefit leaders to see caregiving as a health benefit, given the connections with mental health and burnout that we talked about with self-care. And I would say you're seeing the cost now. it's there, it's probably hidden, but, given 73% of your workforce are in some caregiving journey, either you're seeing it through increase in leave of absence, or total productivity loss, so… I… there is an urgency to act now, and don't… it doesn't need to be just at open enrollment. It can be throughout. And so, I would say those would probably be the top takeaways, Merrill.

Merrell Botello: Yeah, I agree. On the part of the Act now, I wouldn't be shy of just, you know, asking for a quote. I think you'll be surprised on, how it can be implemented within budgets, especially if you have wellness dollars of some sort from your carriers. It is very, a strong, preferred partnership That we have, because it's… it's the need, and we don't talk about it enough, so… Hopefully, you know, keep in contact with us.

We actually, want to just follow up with that email, and we'll attach the presentation, and also give you that CFO guidebook, and then as well as, hopefully, maybe the next time you could join our next webinar, about pets, because we all know that is part of your mental health as well. We're gonna look at, we're gonna partner with United Pet Care and go over pet benefits, not only, you know, taking them to the doctor, but also, you know, how we utilize the… the Pet Angle for Mental Health on September 24th at 2 p.m. Eastern Time and 11 Pacific Standard Time.

All right, thank you, thank you for adding that register… registration link into the chat. We'll take some questions, we're not unmuting, so if you have a question, please put it in the chat.

And if not, we'll give you, a few minutes, but thank you so much, Madhvi. I love this, thank you.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Thank you, Merrill.

Merrell Botello: Alright, looks like there are two in the Q&A. Alright, so if smaller companies cost can be an obstacle. When… when it comes to offering additional benefits and support, how can you, how can this fit into already hard renewal season?

Madhavi Vemireddy: Yeah. I think, Meryl, you mentioned it. I think through our partnership, we really have… Pretty aggressive pricing that's, you know, competitive. I do think, you know, tying it to, the return on investment, right? And tying it to, identifying, you know, mental health strain earlier on. Getting folks to EAP services that need it, proactively, and helping to support employees during their leave of absence and getting them back to work. All of that, you know, can, build your business case.

Merrell Botello: Yeah, and with that, it is a hard renewal season. What I would do is also, you know, let the carriers know, and negotiate those wellness funds, and when they know a program like this is in place, they know it will, you know, help the bottom line if we do it right, and if we do it consistently. So these kind of benefits, the carriers love to hear that we have, because it's not competing with them. which a lot of the vendors are. This is something where we will help, you know. use the wellness funds, not on just gift cards, but also this kind of service. So that, yeah, that's on me, that's on the broker's side.

Yes. Yeah. A second question, will Cleo look into lobbying to include elders into a category that is accounted for under eligible dependents when it comes to insurance?

Madhavi Vemireddy: That's a very interesting question. I know that there are, you know, some of the, sort of policies and… areas of support that we, help families with is, really looking at how do we help caregivers get paid, family caregivers get paid for their services. for, you know, if they're taking care of an adult loved one or a child with special healthcare needs, you know, as per, sort of, Medicaid, you know, guidelines. So, you know, I would say that's probably, you know.

Where we are driving that level of support, and around, you know, obviously paid leave. for caregiving support, we work closely with the National Alliance of Caregiving to really help advocate, for some of the policies there around, you know, the Older Americans Act, and, and related caregiving services.

Merrell Botello: Yeah, and on the benefits side, having, you know, parents or grandparents on the plan, you know, it's… it's just very complicated. Not… not every Every company is able to do that, especially not in the fully insured, but when you are in the self-funded space and you get larger, there are options. That we could share resources. But ultimately, you know, the lobbying part, I already see people, that take care of their parents or drive them around. There are funds for that, and they could essentially be part of that payroll, and so perhaps a Cleo guide could help guide that person through that, and that wouldn't hurt the bottom line for the employer.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Right.

Merrell Botello: Okay, I think we got one more question. For organizations not ready to commit to a budget for Cleo now, what resources can be accessed now to introduce this benefits platform? Are there things we could share with employees if leaders aren't ready to sign the check?

Madhavi Vemireddy: It's an excellent question. I would say the, well, first, you know, we talk about awareness, driving awareness, you know, manager training, so they know to ask about… Caregiving, talk about caregiving, because sometimes what I hear is the first sign of it is when someone… an employee is being put on a… on a PIP plan, a performance improvement plan, because that's… how it shows up, but then when you kind of get at the root cause, it's caregiving that was causing the performance issues. Erg groups, especially around parenting. Caregiving are, are important as well, to share resources. And then just, you know, community resources, right? There are, community resources for elder care, that, you know, we're happy to find, you know, share some of those sites, with this audience as well. But again, a lot of that is… then requires that employee to navigate and sort of figure those, those resources out themselves.

Merrell Botello: Yeah, thank you. Yeah, this is the start of it. We'll send you the deck, you'll have the stats, we could continue this conversation.

Madhavi Vemireddy: But most of all, thank you for joining us. Madhvi, this was excellent. I hope to maybe see you up in San Francisco. We could grab some dinner. Yeah.

Merrell Botello: Nava, you know, NAVA loves having you as a partner. Thank you.

Madhavi Vemireddy: Thank you, everyone on the call. Take care.

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